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Heat cable for terrarium

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PeterD
Guest

Wed Nov 08, 2006 3:59 pm   



On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:56:41 -0500, PeterD <peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

Quote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 07:02:47 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <071120060650151510%lildog_at_donobi.net>, T-n-T
lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <etsuk2htteos9j56v0nk2e4el9oqbvvnns_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Nov 2006 07:46:14 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <8o2sk21bm20qpsom6h6blp5400ukm0ni8f_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 15:09:41 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

Thinking more about it now I do want to err on the side of not killing
my terrarium inhabitants. So a wall wort transformer is the way to go.
the purpose of using wire and a resistor is so the wire can be sealed
in silicone tubing for fish tanks and siliconed on the ends., it just
seems easier to seal up. what theory do I need to apply to heat up say
4 feet of wire not just the resistor?



Okay so I now know how to come up with the length of wire and
transformer. If I wanted to use a long wire and coil it, do the coils
absolutely have to not touch? What if they do? I believe a smaller wire
that is longer and coiled will give me a more pliable cable.

lildog


Ok, i don't know if this falls within the realm of electronics but you
guys may be able to point me in the right direction. Is there a formula
to determine the amount of heat coming off of on eof these cables?

What unit of measure do you think you'd like to see? If I say 15
Joules will that make sense? If I say 15 watts then how about that?
Or, are you interested in temperature rise? Or BTUs? Or Calories?

bg

There are so many ways of saying that!

And, if you are interested in BTU/Hour, 15 watts will give
approximately 51.1 BTU/Hour of heat. A lot depends on ambient
temperature where your tank is located (cool or hot?) and size and
material of construction.

I think you'd be best off using a thermostat to regulate temperature
myself.

T-n-T
Guest

Wed Nov 08, 2006 4:30 pm   



In article <sl32l2p9sb1pm19iteab392i5018keld8j_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
<peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

Quote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 07:02:47 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <071120060650151510%lildog_at_donobi.net>, T-n-T
lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <etsuk2htteos9j56v0nk2e4el9oqbvvnns_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Nov 2006 07:46:14 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <8o2sk21bm20qpsom6h6blp5400ukm0ni8f_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 15:09:41 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

Thinking more about it now I do want to err on the side of not
killing
my terrarium inhabitants. So a wall wort transformer is the way to
go.
the purpose of using wire and a resistor is so the wire can be sealed
in silicone tubing for fish tanks and siliconed on the ends., it just
seems easier to seal up. what theory do I need to apply to heat up
say
4 feet of wire not just the resistor?



Okay so I now know how to come up with the length of wire and
transformer. If I wanted to use a long wire and coil it, do the coils
absolutely have to not touch? What if they do? I believe a smaller wire
that is longer and coiled will give me a more pliable cable.

lildog


Ok, i don't know if this falls within the realm of electronics but you
guys may be able to point me in the right direction. Is there a formula
to determine the amount of heat coming off of on eof these cables?

What unit of measure do you think you'd like to see? If I say 15
Joules will that make sense? If I say 15 watts then how about that?
Or, are you interested in temperature rise? Or BTUs? Or Calories?

bg

There are so many ways of saying that!

Errrr... I guess I would like to be able to calculate how hot in
degrees F a length of said wire will get given voltage of X at Y amps.
OR the number of degrees F the wire will get above it's non-charged
state.

Also if I wanted to coil a long wire to effectively make it shorter do
the coil need to not touch or is that okay? And if they do what would
be the effect?

Once again, thank you guys for your patient help. I know this is a
simple question I have probably not made so clear.

PeterD
Guest

Wed Nov 08, 2006 7:35 pm   



On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 07:30:59 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

Quote:
In article <sl32l2p9sb1pm19iteab392i5018keld8j_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 07:02:47 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <071120060650151510%lildog_at_donobi.net>, T-n-T
lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <etsuk2htteos9j56v0nk2e4el9oqbvvnns_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Nov 2006 07:46:14 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <8o2sk21bm20qpsom6h6blp5400ukm0ni8f_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 15:09:41 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

Thinking more about it now I do want to err on the side of not
killing
my terrarium inhabitants. So a wall wort transformer is the way to
go.
the purpose of using wire and a resistor is so the wire can be sealed
in silicone tubing for fish tanks and siliconed on the ends., it just
seems easier to seal up. what theory do I need to apply to heat up
say
4 feet of wire not just the resistor?



Okay so I now know how to come up with the length of wire and
transformer. If I wanted to use a long wire and coil it, do the coils
absolutely have to not touch? What if they do? I believe a smaller wire
that is longer and coiled will give me a more pliable cable.

lildog


Ok, i don't know if this falls within the realm of electronics but you
guys may be able to point me in the right direction. Is there a formula
to determine the amount of heat coming off of on eof these cables?

What unit of measure do you think you'd like to see? If I say 15
Joules will that make sense? If I say 15 watts then how about that?
Or, are you interested in temperature rise? Or BTUs? Or Calories?

bg

There are so many ways of saying that!

Errrr... I guess I would like to be able to calculate how hot in
degrees F a length of said wire will get given voltage of X at Y amps.
OR the number of degrees F the wire will get above it's non-charged
state.

Humm, that's not likely to happen. Too many variables such as
insulation, insulation diameter, etc. You could get an approximation
but it would be free air values, and not somethign that you will see
in a real application.

Quote:

Also if I wanted to coil a long wire to effectively make it shorter do
the coil need to not touch or is that okay? And if they do what would
be the effect?

If you coil, the coils MUST NOT TOUCH. That assumes bare wire, of
course. If the wire is insulated, and if the insulation is rated for
the temperature that will be found at contact points, then the
*insulation* could touch--but never the bare wires.

Also, if you are running this as a coil, I'd recommend a couple of
turns in one direction and then a couple in the other direction to
minimize magnetic effects and inductance.

Quote:

Once again, thank you guys for your patient help. I know this is a
simple question I have probably not made so clear.

You're not doing that badly now...

Check:

http://www.aeroconsystems.com/electronics/nichrome.htm

Look at their 26 gauge nichrome wire. It is 2.6 ohms a foot, so for
your 14 ohms, you'd use about 5 feet of wire. Their prices are Ok and
they are able to deal in smaller quantities too.

Note: this is bare wire, so you will have to make sure it doesn't
short anywhere.

T-n-T
Guest

Thu Nov 09, 2006 9:19 pm   



In article <ps74l21v89p9dtarcb5d5spmcimo4hfl6d_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
<peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

Quote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 07:30:59 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <sl32l2p9sb1pm19iteab392i5018keld8j_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 07:02:47 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <071120060650151510%lildog_at_donobi.net>, T-n-T
lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <etsuk2htteos9j56v0nk2e4el9oqbvvnns_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Nov 2006 07:46:14 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote:

In article <8o2sk21bm20qpsom6h6blp5400ukm0ni8f_at_4ax.com>, PeterD
peter2_at_hipson.net> wrote:

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 15:09:41 -0800, T-n-T <lildog_at_donobi.net
wrote:

Thinking more about it now I do want to err on the side of not
killing
my terrarium inhabitants. So a wall wort transformer is the way to
go.
the purpose of using wire and a resistor is so the wire can be
sealed
in silicone tubing for fish tanks and siliconed on the ends., it
just
seems easier to seal up. what theory do I need to apply to heat up
say
4 feet of wire not just the resistor?



Okay so I now know how to come up with the length of wire and
transformer. If I wanted to use a long wire and coil it, do the coils
absolutely have to not touch? What if they do? I believe a smaller wire
that is longer and coiled will give me a more pliable cable.

lildog


Ok, i don't know if this falls within the realm of electronics but you
guys may be able to point me in the right direction. Is there a formula
to determine the amount of heat coming off of on eof these cables?

What unit of measure do you think you'd like to see? If I say 15
Joules will that make sense? If I say 15 watts then how about that?
Or, are you interested in temperature rise? Or BTUs? Or Calories?

bg

There are so many ways of saying that!

Errrr... I guess I would like to be able to calculate how hot in
degrees F a length of said wire will get given voltage of X at Y amps.
OR the number of degrees F the wire will get above it's non-charged
state.

Humm, that's not likely to happen. Too many variables such as
insulation, insulation diameter, etc. You could get an approximation
but it would be free air values, and not somethign that you will see
in a real application.


Also if I wanted to coil a long wire to effectively make it shorter do
the coil need to not touch or is that okay? And if they do what would
be the effect?

If you coil, the coils MUST NOT TOUCH. That assumes bare wire, of
course. If the wire is insulated, and if the insulation is rated for
the temperature that will be found at contact points, then the
*insulation* could touch--but never the bare wires.

Also, if you are running this as a coil, I'd recommend a couple of
turns in one direction and then a couple in the other direction to
minimize magnetic effects and inductance.


Once again, thank you guys for your patient help. I know this is a
simple question I have probably not made so clear.

You're not doing that badly now...

Check:

http://www.aeroconsystems.com/electronics/nichrome.htm

Look at their 26 gauge nichrome wire. It is 2.6 ohms a foot, so for
your 14 ohms, you'd use about 5 feet of wire. Their prices are Ok and
they are able to deal in smaller quantities too.

Note: this is bare wire, so you will have to make sure it doesn't
short anywhere.


The weekend is quickly coming up and I am going to try this all out,
will let you know. Will probably have more questions. Thanks again

lildog

Dan Taylor
Guest

Wed Dec 06, 2006 5:16 am   



FYI

If the heat tape you describe is like all the rest of standard heat tapes,
the knob on the end is not a resistor. It is simply a plastic cap filled
with silicone to keep out moisture and to prevent grounding of the two
conductive wires. Most commercial heat tapes use about 3 watts per linear
foot. The material between the two conductive wires is a resistive material
which heats up as current passes between the hot and neutral. If a heat tape
is cut too long, the resistance becomes too great for the current to
overcome it and the heat tape won't heat. The better tape kits have either a
little glass fuse in the plug or it will have a reset button.

Good Luck

Dan
"T-n-T" <lildog_at_donobi.net> wrote in message
news:041120060924529796%lildog_at_donobi.net...
Quote:
I was wondering if anyone could help me with a design of a heat cable
for my new terrarium. I have on fairly expensive cable and would like
to duplicate it. It has a 110v plug at one end and is about 8 feet
long. The end has a small knob which I assume is a resistor of some
sort. The actual heating part of the cable is about four feet long, the
rest is just to get to the outlet. Oh yeah it is 15 watts. I think for
someone who knows how this works should be a no brainer. I recently saw
an article somewhere that suggested using a toaster or aquarium heater
element, halved , coiled around a small wire and threaded into a
silicone tube. Any advice would be excellent, thank you.

BTW, i have seen some online for planted aquariums that use a long
length of wire, which is exactly what I need but seems to be really
long.
http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/Tech/


Highland Ham
Guest

Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:49 am   



Quote:
Do recognize that putting line voltage into an environment that is wet
(your's may be very dry, I don' t know) is risky...

A simple heater might be easily made from a wall wart that gives 12 to
14 volts AC at about 1.2 (or more) amps. Use a 15 watt resistor (maybe
Radio Shack) that is about 10 to 14 ohms in resistance. An AC wall
wart will work well in this application. That will limit voltages in
the terranium to a safe value (don't want your livestock chewing on
the cables, right?) An improvement woudl be to clamp the resistor to
an aluminum plate (say 4 x 4 inches or 100 mm square) that is perhaps
an 1/8" thick. That will help spread the heat out and limit hot
spotting some.
======================================

You might consider using heating tape which produces heat in the order
of 15 - 20 Watts per metre . It is used to keep water pipes frost free.
For a short length as probably required for your terrarium you need a
transformer with voltage outputs in the 5 -24 V range , with a number of
voltage taps. This heating tape is insulated and can be found at
industrial electrical components suppliers.
For safety reasons do not apply voltages above 24 V and make sure that
metal parts of the terrarium are always earthed whatever the heater
voltage.

Frank

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